Welcome, Guest
Username: Password:
Talk about the tools we use to give GREAT mileage on engines.
  • Page:
  • 1

TOPIC: Cutter Marking Jig

Cutter Marking Jig 08 Aug 2012 20:37 #1

  • GadgetmanSaskatchewan
  • Visitor
  • Visitor
Well Tracy G has been bugging me for awhile to explain, with pictures, my marking jig. So I'll make him happy by posting it now. (About time, eh Tracy?)

My first jig I made out of a strip of spruce lath and a finishing nail. The one I use now is made from a strip of rosewood (its' hard) and a HHS drill bit (sharper), about 3/32" diam.

Waiver: if this helps anyone, or if it is of value and with the basic idea, can improve on it, go hard!

Here is what I did: (forgive me if I explain too much: if this helps someone who may have just a little experience at the moment in jig making, good!)

Overview: This jig helps maintain a proper cutter angle (in this case, 26 degrees, which is roughly halfway between the ideal range of 22.5 to 30 degrees). This allows for some leeway in cutting angle. It works by scribing a line in the throttle body downstream from the plate, so that when the top of the large cutter is touching the throttle plate and the bottom back edge of the cutter is touching the scribed line, the cut will be at the desired angle. The finished jig is shown below:



I needed to determine the original angle of the throttle plate for the throttle body I was working on. To do this, I took a piece of stiff cardboard (non-corregated) and with the longer straight edge against the throttle bore (parallel to the sides), I cut the short side edge which rides against the plate itself, until it matched the angle of the plate. (As some bores widen under the plate, and are therefore angled in the bore where you measure, I used a small square at the base of the TB to make sure the long edge of the cardboard was parallel to the bore.)


Here you can see the angled edge which matches up with the throttle angle.



Once I was sure that the angle was correct, I used a compass to determine the degree. In this case I am presenting, the angle was 16 deg. (It may be 12 deg, etc: check and determine)


Next, I transferred the angle to some stiff cardboard



Next I transferred the cutting angle that I wanted (26 deg), but bisecting the first marked angle at the point about 5/16" above the bottom (which corresponds to the diameter of the larger cutter). This intersection is where the top of the cutter would be touching when first starting the cut.






The bottom edge of the cardboard represents where the cutter actually cuts into the throttle body wall. The difference in the angle is where the rear bottom edge of the cutter would rest on the throttle body wall to start the cut. In this case it is about 3/32" back from the plate. The scriber is a sharpened drill bit tapped into an undersized hole in the wooden strip, with about 1/64" of the sharpened tip showing, with a drop of CA glue (crazy glue) to secure it from pushing through when scribing. The front bottom edge of the jig rides up against the bottom of the throttle plate, and the scriber is set back 3/32" (determined again from the angle difference between the original throttle plate angle and the desired cutting angle).








Here are some other shots of the jig:





Here is the picture showing all the angles:



When the jig is used, make the scribed line from throttle plate axle to axle. The line scribed should be parallel to the throttle plate. Once the cut is started, with top edge just touching the plate and the bottom edge starting the cut on the scribed line, maintain the angle and cut straight down. The top of the cutter of course will be no longer touching the throttle plate as per the angle difference.

This jig may be used with various different angles of throttle plates, but I always check the throttle angle first and measure back so that I know for sure that the cutter angle is within the proper parameters of 22.5 and 30 degrees. Know also that this jig is a guide only and practice and mods are the key.

This, for me, helps in establishing a correct angle without guessing, and after a while, the angle will come more easily as it becomes established in your mind.

Hope this helps.

Regards,
Luke

This message has attachments images.
Please log in or register to see it.

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Last edit: by GadgetmanSaskatchewan.

Re: Cutter Marking Jig 10 Aug 2012 05:18 #2

  • Tracy Gallaway
  • Offline
  • Founder
  • Founder
  • Posts: 1881
  • Karma: 178
  • Thank you received: 564
Luke, Thank you, you ROCK, Buddy. My eyes are too tired to reply in detail about this, but in scanning this Excellent Post I can see you did yeoman work w/this!!

ALL HAIL LUKE! ALL HAIL LUKE!

(sound of 10.000 combat boots striking the pavement as the Gadgetman Brigade comes to Attention)

(followed by sound of 5000 fists thumping chests as the Brigade gives the Gadgetman Salute)

what is the Gadgetman Salute...? :blink:

TracyG Gadgetman Reno
Tracy Gallaway
Founder and Constant Aide to Gadgetman
Gadgetman Reno, NV

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Re: Cutter Marking Jig 10 Aug 2012 17:38 #3

  • GadgetmanSaskatchewan
  • Visitor
  • Visitor
Thank-you for your comment. I'm sure that there are much better ways to skin this cat. Works now for me. (By the way, have you ever been a stand-up comedian in your career!!??)

Luke

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Re: Cutter Marking Jig 12 Aug 2012 23:50 #4

  • phil
  • Visitor
  • Visitor
I had the idea of chunky self-adhesive rubber strips with the magic angle cut on one face.
You mark a line with a fine tip marker where the groove is going to run.
Then wedge the throttle plate up out of the way from the back.
Next bend and stick the rubber strip in place, and youve got a guide in the right place to follow for the groove.

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Re: Cutter Marking Jig 13 Aug 2012 02:58 #5

  • Rick Ensor
  • Visitor
  • Visitor
Luke,

Sometimes, I'm a little slow on the uptake. In any case, I may be a little confused. What angle do you cut on the leading edge of the scribe? And wouldn't this angle change with various TB's, depending on the angle of a particular throttle plate; thereby requiring different angles on the leading edge of the scribe?

Stated another way, the question is would not the distance from the bottom edge of the throttle plate to the point of the scribe, in this case 3/32", vary depending on the original angle of the throttle plate; thereby requiring a different scribes for different throttle plate angles?

Or is there something I am missing?

Rick Ensor

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Re: Cutter Marking Jig 13 Aug 2012 04:26 #6

  • TacomaKarl
  • Visitor
  • Visitor
Hi Rick,

The throttle plate position is relevant to the idle position on fly by wire TB, aka computer controlled.

For cable controlled, throttle plate idle position is zeroed out and the groove is cut at that position.

Once the groove is cut, the idle is adjusted incorporating the groove into the idle.


Karl Fortner
Tacoma, Washington

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Re: Cutter Marking Jig 13 Aug 2012 06:12 #7

  • Rick Ensor
  • Visitor
  • Visitor
Karl,

Would you mind sharing your phone number so that we might communicate a little more efficiently?

Thanks,

Rick Ensor
cell: 541-973-9116

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Re: Cutter Marking Jig 15 Aug 2012 07:45 #8

  • Tracy Gallaway
  • Offline
  • Founder
  • Founder
  • Posts: 1881
  • Karma: 178
  • Thank you received: 564
Hi Luke and Thanks Again for that, I think you poked the hornet's nest of Thought here! So this jig technique would be custom made for each Groove job, but could be re-used on identical TB's Not bad...

I'm no designer, but my spoiled nature ( well I like tools that spoil me, witness the Panavice Mod#301) would just dig a Jig that was universal/adjustable:woohoo:

But that is having the cake and eating it too, probably.

And i'm no Stand up comedian, though I am known in my day job for off the wall humorous banter w/ customers..stupid joke: "how many engineers does it take to change a light bulb? . . . . Answer: It doesn't matter, the Light bulb must Want to change!" I can use that ad-nauseum, 'cause guests are ever-changing. Warning: don't get in an elevator w/ me, I'm liable to pull anything out of thin air and say it...

Back to topic: Great Post, Great creativity, Luke!

TracyG Gadgetman Reno
Tracy Gallaway
Founder and Constant Aide to Gadgetman
Gadgetman Reno, NV

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Re: Cutter Marking Jig 16 Aug 2012 17:06 #9

  • GadgetmanSaskatchewan
  • Visitor
  • Visitor
HI Rick

You are absolutely correct: the differing angles of the throttle plate would change the distance that the scriber is positioned. That is why you have to find the plate angle first. For instance, if a different plate angle using the same jig made for a 16 deg plate is used, it may work without any modifications if the end result allows a cutting angle anywhere between 22.5 to 30 degrees. If it is beyond that, then you can modify the jig by either sanding the end down for steeper angles or adding thin cardboard to the end for shallower angles. That is why I set my jig for 26 deg, roughly the mid point.

And Tracy, I had in my mind a thin brass end, with a brass block in which the scribe is imbedded, on an adjustable threaded thumb wheel, inserted through a rosewood handle. I like my tools too, but that's a lot for just a line! I look at it, for me, as an aid to getting the range in the proper angle more concrete, so that when I have done over a 1000 like Ron, it comes naturally.

Take care,
Luke

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Re: Cutter Marking Jig 16 Aug 2012 23:54 #10

  • Tracy Gallaway
  • Offline
  • Founder
  • Founder
  • Posts: 1881
  • Karma: 178
  • Thank you received: 564
Couldn't agree more, Luke! Practice improves technique. More the better, 'till a jig isnt needed anymore.
Again, we just need to follow the four rules...

TracyG Gadgetman Reno
Tracy Gallaway
Founder and Constant Aide to Gadgetman
Gadgetman Reno, NV

Please Log in to join the conversation.

  • Page:
  • 1
Powered by Kunena Forum