TOPIC: 1997 chev 1500 pickup 350 vortex

This truck had very bad water leak problems from heads not to outside then one day had a trip to hospital for wife (rooster attack) 5 stitches 4 staples later she is ok but truck did not do well at all . Both heads and block cracked so have new engine now with about 12,000 miles now.
Started out with 12 mpg, did PCV and EVAP reroute of vacuum lines. Cut ground and gaped Platinum plugs to .074, made round trip Savannah to Atlanta Ga., now have 16.7 mpg.
Groove coming soon
I want to know what is in Atlanta gas (snog test still done ) that is not in Savannah gas ( no snog test ) .... Filled 32 gal tank for trip to Atlanta filled up at Koger 21 gal for 1 mpg increase filled up at Koger ~ 23 gals gained 3.7 mpg going home What is in or not in gas in Atlanta vs Saannah Ga.
There is no uphill or downhill evolved, no altitude problems, sea level here, no temp change, some how gas is different

geraldc

there is a problem with my copper non-resistor plugs
when I started 1997 chev truck 350 vortec today plugs started misfiring. At different times at different speeds misfiring was felt by wife and I.
Trying to find a fix for this misfiring: will try
1. reset computer
2. re gap plugs down from .074
3. put Platinum plugs gap to .074 back in ( they did run very well )

copper non-resistor plugs gap .074 had no noise on radio

any suggestion will be welcome
more info under this link for my 1997 chev truck

geraldc

Gerald, was the heat range w/ copper plugs different? Sorry if ya already mentioned in that thread, I'm just lazy here talkin' w/ my fingers. Don't remenber, does this engine have plug wires, even short ones?

Tracy G

as for as I know heat range is right The number for these plugs came from the parts house books and these plugs were looked up by 3 different people at parts house NAPA
And these copper plugs did real good ... put in Friday .. ran Saturday about 3 hours totally and 45 min Sunday ... started misfiring Monday morning going to town
Just standard wires been on from the engine being installed about 12,000 miles ago
geraldc

Have re-gaped copper plugs from .074 to .070 -- did a test run 4 miles no misfiring at all so making a longer trip to town tomorrow hopefully no misfiring
Plugs were very clean all white around positive post is clean as if washed -- I have pulled many plugs never have I seen clean plugs like these

update on 1997 chev truck MPG
at home have just filled up and wife did MPG check with Savannah ga. Kroger regular gas back too 13 MPG dang lost all 3.7 MPG gain from Atlanta gas and .070 gap is misfiring -- so will take another .004 off be .066 tomorrow if rain stops
going to check ohms on wires too
geraldc

update 11/4/13 1997 chev truck
new copper plugs ground cut and re gaped to .066 misfiring is still happening but only after normal operating temp is reach.
Can this a computer thing??? did not reset computer this time maybe the resistor plugs are needed for the control of firing unless other things are done also
geraldc

update yes Champion plugs
13,,RS14YC6
doing a MPG check now on this tank-- gas gauge(electronic I do not trust it) says 3/4 full with 210 miles
so far misfiring not happening until engine warmed then may or may not misfire at any time-- I do want to know what MPG on this tank will be before I change anything
geraldc

update new tank of Savannah Ga. Kroger regular gas now and Platinum plugs with .074 gap are back in engine
a MPG increase of .5 mpg on 355.5 miles with copper plugs gap to .066 and still misfiring a random Do not like misfiring for this truck in traffic may not response when needed.
Thanks Ron this engine is a new engine with about 13,000 mile now. Bought truck with about 17,000 miles on it and had real internal water leaks, did replace both head gaskets 2 times then had rooster attack on wife (she is fine) and rooster and truck did not do well after, rooster is gone and truck had both heads cracked and block cracked thus new engine

Kroger has refused to talk to me about the gas at all so can not find the difference between Savannah and Atlanta Ga. gas -- will keep digging

Gerald were those copper plugs Champion?

I made it a practice to only use those in older Mopar engines, just my own experience

IF the Chev. likes the platinums, but not the copper ones, well, ya know what I'd sayy...

BTW, I only used the non resist. Torquemasters from Extremespark, 'cause non resistor is a requirement for Aaron Murikami's Plasma Jet Ignition mod.

And I gotts report, that while my engine has run better w/ THAT mod I think RF or EMF radiations from it are messing w/ my Subaru's ECM. I never got to buying/adding braided sheathing for the plug wires or the diode block wires. And I don't know if that would have blocked the RF, or even if RF noise has been the culprit. Have no idea what test equip needed to check for such electronic noise.

Due to fortuitous circumstances My ECM will soon be going away anyhow...

Do let us know what you wind up with for your Chevy!

Tracy G

Gerald,

I've tried to follow your posts on your truck, please forgive me if I missed something completely.

I have a 93 Chevy with the pre-vortec 350 in it and I saw more help from misfires with a change of the coil. I'm not sure if you have looked into this but my truck runs a lot better now with a new one.


Ken

Thanks Ken
The misfiring is from the copper plugs I think so far -- I can put the resistor plugs back in and no misfiring at all gaped to .074 and ground cut to vertical plane of positive post.. This engine and coil only has about 13,000 miles now -- every thing on the new engine was new when installed

Be sure you've checked your Small Block Chev engines for bad intake manifold gaskets! There is a flaw in the engine design, as it allows combusted gases at more than 500 degrees F to contact the paper gaskets which burn at 450.

This occurs at the EGR ports in the middle of the heads, as the gas passes up into the intake manifold. With these vehicles over 50K miles on these gaskets, I recommend them to be replaced as a matter of course.

This may also ad to engine misfires!

Think about it!

Ron

Yes I guessed so. Don't remember where/when but sometime I picked up the idea that champion's are best for Chrysler engines. As in 60's/70's old school Mopar... Chrysler used 'em as OEM equip. plugs to resist fouling is what I remember. Nothing official I'm sure Champion's work OK in lots of app's just my position.

Tracy G

Hi Gerald,

On the gas mileage, keep in mind that different pump nozzles will kick off at different times, that is why you gauge it on the pump you started with.
Always calculate round trip average based on start point fillup up and return fillup at same pump.

On the plugs, stock is usually .032 to .035, yes more is better as long as it will run properly.
As Ron proved out on his tests, the more gap the cleaner the burn. This works best on fixed rpm engines, when the rpm's vary on a car engine this may not be as accurate.

If you have a standard coil on the engine, at higher rpm's the coil has less time to recover for the next firing and the longer that coil is running the warmer it is going to get.

Enter solid state ignition systems...

Karl Fortner
Tacoma, Washington

Thanks Tacomakarl
Yes I am aware of pump nozzle cut offs so I fill until can not put any more in without spilling. A fillup at same pump nozzle can not always be done example round trip is to far for refill at same place, nozzle has been changed by station during maintenance or pump changed.

For this engine plug gap calls for .060 they are at .074 now and truck is running fine, still driving on 1st tank full can't wait for mpg check
geraldc

update 11-21-13
head gaskets is leaking water into cylinder(s). Misfiring is getting bad. same thing last engine done. and Ron I will be looking at EGR valve in middle of heads any suggestions on a fix would help-- had thought about the RVS stuff -- will talk to Justin before I do anything also going to order RVS for my 6006 Duetz tractor
geraldc

update 11-25-13
put 1997 chev truck in shop today for intake Fel-Pro gasket application $400.00 + gasket not bad here, was told 3 other places over $600.00. Shop owner does the work and has done several of these intakes, when I talked to him he knew exactly what was going on right down to vacuum on radiator when cooled so should be back by Wednesday.
geraldc

update 12-3-13
1997 truck home again after intake gaskets renewed for $468.51 - no water leak found inside or outside - had Fel-Pro intake gaskets on it now new Fel-Pro gaskets on it again - Still losing water somewhere, radiator still has vacuum on it with water down. Misfiring is still there but not as bad - Found a plug wire #4 bad. Will be replacing plugs and plug wire soon. Truck does seem to run better, quieter and smoother.
geraldc

update 12-10-13
1997 chev truck does NOT misfiring any more applied new wires, Belden Edge wire guaranty for life of engine will I own it. Runs great but still has water going somewhere -- no external leak -- all new Fel-Pro gaskets

---

many years ago seen 3 different engines at different times were rebuild with probably 20k or more on each and you could fill them up when warm drive them and check water level -- it would always be down about 3 inches to same place each time -- the engines like that water level always run good at that level-- maybe this is what is happening
geraldc

update 12-15-13
1997 chev truck applied new double platinum plugs today gapped to .074 ground not cut runs even better
fill tank today and increased mpg by 1 -- 13.2 mpg now so wires did some good
still have not found any leaks measured water level today 3" down cold - plan to measure and look for leaks every day -- if I can find a pressure tester will apply pressure - if not I will make one
geraldc

update 12-21-13
could not measure below radiator tubes but put more anti-freeze in yesterday. Still no leak found

I am looking for a portable mpg device to plug in and see mpg as I drive - if anyone knows of one Please post here Thank You or call me 912-658-7561 savannah ga have truck will travel wahoooo
geraldc

question is there a way to do a search on this site for a particular item ? example I want to know about a 1994 V6 Brick EGR valve, if on the site How can I do a search ??

1-2-14 update 8 aspirin in truck today, ran good, putting 8 more in tomorrow for trip to Atlanta Ga. will not put any more in until at least 3 fillups have happened
geraldc

update 5-4-14
my 350 chev truck running great has 4 new O2 sensors,, 16 aspirin with 6 oz EverClear 190 proof grain alcohol "happy truck" ,, plugs gaped to .074,, 14.4 mpg last fillup with regular gas in Savannah ga at Kroger.

Going to drop plug gap down to .068 and put 8 aspirin with 6 oz of EverClear 190 proof as an experiment -- to see if computer will change mpg. Will do this for at least 4 tanks of gas. I am using 4 layers of a white kitchen paper towel to filter aspirin, tea filter did not get all particles as wanted.

My water leak is still there ,, went to a head rebuild shop and told owner what was going on with leak. He showed me the same heads as on my truck, these heads do not have EGR gases going thro a center hole in head, no holes in head other than for each cylinder operation. He did recommend using a stop leak with the new anti-freeze but I am still looking at changing anti-freeze to the old style anti-freeze.
geraldc

update 5-18-14
plugs are gaped at .068 and 8 aspirin with 3 oz of EverClear 190 proof,, yes 3 oz,, did computer memory removal for 2 hours, tank is full 32 gal
trying to stop the pinging sound when mesh gas go faster -- as for 8 aspirin just to see if computer likes it better than 16 aspirin
geraldc

In my quest for gasoline answers my friend in the gas and diesel tank cleaning business for about 40 years has wrote the following;

So to answer your question in a nutshell, its solely based on the EPA/EPD regulations placed on fuel and their locations in atlanta versus other areas around town. Mainly, the fuel has to be a cleaner blend due to emissions and smog in atlanta, so you are in a sense getting a much purer fuel which will burn a small percentage cleaner, but on a massive road trip like you guys take, that will make quite a difference. Not only is there the cleaner fuel blend, also most pumps and certainly pumps at higher volume locations in atlanta have what is known as vapor recovery. What vapor recovery does is constantly put a small vacuum on the product as its dispensing thus removing the vapor from your fuel as you pump it, in a sense it is making sure that your tank is filled with more gas than the normal gas/gas vapor mix. The vapor is then "recovered" back to their tank underground and actually over the period of a year can add quite a bit of fuel back to their inventory. It is basically condensed much in the way that a liquor still works.

Savannah doesn't have quite the regulations that atlanta does and most places outside of major cities don't have those same regulations, so outside of buying a higher octane fuel (but not so high that it burns rich and thus faster) i am afraid it would be rather hard to get the same results economically with an outside fuel. What dad and i do is condense and purify whatever fuel we get here, let the sun and heat from the sun clarify the fuel, and we quadruple filter it before dispensing into our cars. The difference is astounding, but it takes alot of work aswell.

Hope this has helped to answer any questions you have. Also another thing that helps the fuel economy is the weather, not just outside, but the temperature allows the tanks underground to remain at a cooler temperature and thus not vapor as much. When it gets quite hot the gas temp in the ground is anywhere from the upper 70s to upper 80s, rarely more. When it is cooler, the gas temp will be anywhere from the lower 60s to the mid 70s. On the rare occasion in the summer, the gasoline at certain stations will become so hot that the entire fueling system becomes vaporlocked and will not pump until everything cools down. We have to sometimes prime the lines with ice water. Really interesting when you think about it.

No he does not tell what to put in gas to help with mpg but a good place to start a new round of questions.
geraldc