TOPIC: double Groove TB on Karl's Mazda/Ford truck

So Karl, does the O2 screw back into the manifold OK? There are spark plug thread chaser tools that act like a tap. You carefully thread it into the hole to "chase" or clean up the threads,using a spark plug socket (or whatever works) to drive the thread chaser. The spark plug chaser is less aggressive to the threads than a regular tap. Could be it needs a tap. IF they are REALLY bad, the threads could be fixed w/ a
Heli-Coil kit. O2 sensors are basically a gutted-out spark plug body, unless in your Mazda's case Ford had a Better Idea... But I doubt that. Also, once the whole hole/thread issue is fixed OK, I would use a tiny bit of Anti-Seize compound on the O2 threads, I'm guessing the O2 extender was screwed in dry to begin with. For this tapped hole in the exhaust manifold, to me, anti-seize compound would be mandatory for an O2 or O2 extender's threads. I would have treated the extender's and the O2's threads both, taking care not to get any on the O2's sensor tip. Don't need much, just enough to sit in the thread grooves. If there is any gap in the threads in the O2 sensor hole in this iron manifold, then could be an exhaust leak, an attendant O2 sensor malfunction.




IF you installed the O2 extender dry, then this is your lesson. The Wise One in the secret Himilayan hamlet would have just struck you with his stick. If a mechanic did that, then a Pox upon him!

Karl, considering it's mid-October, and Halloween draws near- IF there are any elderly Hungarian or Balkan- looking women about, be nice to them if you get the chance, especially if she looks like a Fortune Teller (or a Witch). Hold the door for her, smile, etc.... Just in case there is a Curse upon the Mazda, if you curry enough Favor, maybe, just maybe, it might be lifted... ?

(Oh crap, I didn't think Karl was THAT strong "Karl Buddy, drop the boulder, hey man, someone's gonna get hurt!! Like I wuz just tryin' to be funny, like....KARL!!!.....Tracy runs for his life...)

Crap like these messed up threads is the kinda lessons we all gotta learn in Wrenching. BTW, this isn't an O2 bung, it's tapped hole in an iron exhaust manifold. A bung is a fitting in steel exhaust pipe, and if it was a bung, and in a good location, it might have been possible for an Exhaust shop to remove it and weld in a new bung.

I'm assuming there is enough room in there to get tools in to repair the tapped hole in the exh. manifold, or else that's maybe why the mechanic wanted to pull the manifold to work on it.

IS there now a code for the upstream O2?

Man, I'm sorry for this trouble Karl, this kind of stuff sucks! That old man's stick hurts!

Tracy G

Greg,Tracy,

Got the 02 back in but not all the way due to the threads and was going to get the threader from A-Z for about $13 just to clean it up so it fits deeper. Not threaded fully due to my attempts at removal.
The 02 was installed without the anti-seize(I have the same jar as you) since I remembered after I put it in that I forgot to dope it. Thought I was just going to test it for a week or two to see if its worth it and then take it out and dope it. Well the dope forgot to dope it and look what happened. Very valuable lesson. I usually dope everything but not this time.
Tracy, did you really have to put that gunk on a nice rag just for the pic? That stuff is a pain to remove unless you use alcohol or acetone or similar. Thanks for the pic for this post but was not necessary. That stuff is a mess to work with, hard/impossible to remove from scratches and cracks.
Its best to put the dope on the threads of the 02 instead of in the hole for the very reason you mentioned of getting it on the tip. Trying to thread it in the hole with it already on the pipe threads can be an issue if you hit the threads with the 02 tip as you are putting it in.
Better to put only on the 02 threads unless you were an expert at the game "Operation".
Remember that one .......old man?
I still have the 0131 and 0132 codes and the engine bogs down every now and then(mpg goes down to 15mpg on the gauge and feels like going up a 30 degree grade) with the 02 not functioning I guess. Goes between open and closed loops but the bogging happens only in closed. Guess the mess with this damaged to 02 somehow.

I think everyone at one point in time has/had a jar of that particular anti-seize in their toolbox or on the shelf in their workshop/garage. (Guilty as charged, right at this moment)

Looking at those codes in the Hayes Manual for Rangers/B-series of that year, the p0130 indicates a sensor resistance issue (too much carbon build-up?), while the p0131 is just a "something is wrong here" warning. I'd say it's failed, and that's messing with fuel delivery and thus power. Considering how much time your truck spends in open loop (Are you SURE the ECT sensor is functioning properly?), that O2 sensor is probably pretty toasted anyways; while it's a pain to do 9especially in this case), it falls under general Maintenance as far as I'm concerned. Just don't forget to use the anti-seize that comes with it this time, sir.

The codes I have are 0131 and 0132...no 0130 code.
Since I had the 02 "stuck" in the hole before I repaired it, maybe there was some damage done since its not old, less than 2 years.
What is that? I know the ECU is the computer junk that gives me the real issue with this truck but dont know the ECT.
Between the open loop issue that started with the 02 extender issue and the 30-40 STFT, I am lucky to be getting 25 mpg. Have to order a new 02 and see what happens with that fix.
Wont be for another 2 weeks or so till I get it, special order since the truck is so old.

My mistake on the codes.

ECT= Engine Coolant Temperature sensor. There are 2, one for the computer (2 wires), and one for the instrument cluster with one wire. The computer derives open/closed loop fuel delivery based on the 2-wire feedback. If it is out of spec/malfunctioning, the computer can't shorten injector times to put less fuel in the engine, and that extra fuel will keep burning on the way out past exhaust valves and the upstream O2 sensor, likely burning it out as is the case here, I'll wager, and possibly the catalytic converter as well. And that sensor's bad info at the computer verifies the ECT signal to keep dumping fuel in. If your thermostat fails in the closed position, it'll be catastrophic.

You're burning up your engine. Prematurely. And a hole in your fuel budget and wallet, Not to mention the environment. I'll bet that O2 sensor was almost welded into the manifold pipe, especially since it wasn't anti-seized.

I don't want to sound alarmist, but these indicators are canaries in the coal mine, and they've been chirping for a while now.

Exhaust airflow being clogged by a melted catalytic honeycomb might also cause the truck to hesitate under load/acceleration and possibly even buck. And the downstream O2 won't say anything because it's seeing clean air...from the output side mostly.

My earlier diagnosis is starting to really firm up Karl. While you're waiting on the new O2, swap out the ECT and see what happens with open/closed loop. The coolant loss from not draining that system will be negligible, and it's colour might be an indicator of engine health/condition as well.

Without having to test it with a meter, how does one determine if that sensor is working?
Getting the temps around 184 degrees when hot is the only way I see with the Scangauge.
Dont want to throw money at the truck that is not necessary. Been there,done that...no more.

The truck bogs down for about 10-20 seconds while in closed running down the highway maybe once or twice during a 30 mile trip and am associating this with the 02's not registering since it does swing back and forth occasionally between open and closed loop. Gets into closed almost immediately then goes into open for a while before back into closed. Plus I dont get that clean smell I used to have with the exhaust.
These are the only clues I have to play with for a diagnosis unless a volt meter is needed.

I'll have to do some hunting on the ford ranger forums for resistance ranges, because ECT is a simple thermistor. They're not expensive - under $20 - and compared to replacing the catalytic converter and/or engine, it's half a tank of gas. If it helps turn your trims down, you'll get that back in very short order.

Karl, Dr Dude has you well covered w/ his diagnosis, IMHO. I really can't add any more to this, so I will drone for a moment about what a clogged cat. can do. Yrs ago, when I was a self employed mechanic, a friend w/ an electric shop asked me to fix a Ford 1/2 ton pickup that had a 300 cu. in. straight six, computer feedback carbureted (yuck). It had had an engine compartment fire. What happened was some idiot ran leaded gas in it awhile, and contaminated, then slowly clogged the cat. Finally the exhaust got blocked enough to heat the heck out of the engine, it warped the long exhaust manifold into an arch- and then the carb. caught fire. I had to replace the carb, hoses, belts, and the underhood wiring harnesses. Spent over 2 weeks on it, then it had to go to a diagnostic specialist to figure out some computer issues, (He wasn't too happy before he was done, either!) A big mucho hassle for all concerned!

Point is, Dr dude is correct in general speaking of what overly-rich mixture can do. Maybe the Dr. will find and post spec's for the ECT resistance values, they should be a table or group of specified resistance in Ohms measured across the ECT sensor electric terminals. IT will be a certain resistance spec or range, at a specified temp. IF there was a Pick and Pull self-service type junkyard around, I'd go look there. Do you have a digital volt-ohm meter? That's a worthwhile tool to have, mine has a set of leads with removeable alligator clips, w/ the clips off there's pointed ends. Must have diagnostic tool, IMHO.
Cause w/ a DVOM, you could check your ECT coolant temp sensors on the engine and verify them. There's el Cheapo ones at parts stores, mine was about 40 bucks 20 yrs ago, Don't really need the expensive pro ones to get the job done.

Here's my Sunpro DVOM





Tracy G

Karl, if ya haven't already, pull the electrical plug off both ECT sensors to check for corrosion and good connections, it might be intermittent bad connection, Tracy

yeah, the contacts between connector and sensor may need burnishing. That sensor is right at the front of the engine next to/near the thermostat housing where the upper rad hose attaches, so it could be exposed to leaks there or from moisture coming under the hood/through the grille

I've just re-read Karl's last few posts, and it's a very good thing the cooling system is working correctly. 184 degrees is about where the thermostat should be opening...but does this look familiar?
P0135 - OBD-II Trouble Code

Here's a link I found:
Temperature gauge/ECT sender mystery - Ranger-Forums - The Ultimate Ford Ranger Resource
and at the bottom of that page, this:
ECT Sensor & Sender Removal & install - Ranger-Forums - The Ultimate Ford Ranger Resource
and from the same google search:

and this:


notice the DTCs in the last one are creeping up towards your 131/132

I'd check your coolant level FIRST. Take the rad cap off when the engine is cold, squeeze the upper rad hose to see if the level drops - if so, top it off - and then check the level in the reservoir, and top that off too. A short trip should work out any bubbles in the system, so while it's still running check that there's pressure in the upper rad hose, and that the reservoir is at the FULL HOT mark (the plastic seam, around halfway full) and top that off too. once that all equalizes, check and see what your scantool has to say as far as coolant temp and Open/Closed loop. I'm thinking there may be a bubble, or the wrong thermostat in there - 180 degrees is a common replacement, but that won't let the engine get hot enough to trigger closed loop.

Computers are stupid - they only do what they're programmed to, and if they're getting incorrect input, they'll respond incorrectly.

My mom's little 4banger Pontiac/Toyota puddle jumper - she takes it to the quick lube place closest to the house. After a recent oil change, she noticed that on cold starts, there was a squealy/squeaky noise. I checked the oil - dipstick seemed to be below the bottom indicator. I put in a quart...seemed fine, took it for a drive, checked again. dipstick said it needed another quart, which I added and then took it for another drive (no oil light or engine light during all of this). Dipstick still says low, it's not leaking on the garage floor, What the...??? 3rd check, another quart required and added, another drive and the level is where it should be. bubble in the dipstick - quick change place got fooled too, and didn't add enough oil. she was running around on about a quarter of what the oil system should've been pumping. the squeaky noise at cold start has gone.

And then there's my grandmother - still driving at 88 years old, despite recently getting her first (speeding) ticket - who was driving around with severely underinflated tires: she got new shoes for her ride that were a different size than stock and the new kid at the shop inflated to what the door sticker said for the stock size, 12-15psi too low for the new tires! she's happy that her little car isn't eating Gasoline like it has a tapeworm anymore, being a poor retired widow lady on a pension. I just hope she doesn't get another ticket - that one will be my fault!

Moral: check and check and check again.

(thanks for the vote of confidence, Tracy)

Man not only did the good Doctor just give some excellent advice on engine maintenance Tactics-- he also gave me a good laugh!

Gasoline Tapeworms! oh Gosh...!

Remember the Hydrogen Peroxide in the MPGR?
Should it be MPGTR, Miles Per Gallon Tapeworm Remedy...??

So MPGTR becomes a National Brand product sold in auto parts, big box and conveinience stores, and now I'm startin' to hear a Jingle in my head to go at the start and end of the TV and radio ads...

"There's a Tapeworm in your Gas,
But we're gonna Kill It Fast!
Use MPG,
MPG,
M P G T R!! " ( insert Voice Over here...) with fast 2-beat Banjo music or Bluegrass music continuing in audio backround...

I figgre the good Doctor has more than passing familiarity w/ my concept here...

Greg, excellent advice on all you just posted, Thank You!!

Tracy G

I pulled off the radiator cap to see the level when I arrived home and it exploded all over me.
I now have burns all over my hands. THANKS GREG!!!!!
I will never listen you your advice again!!!!
Only kidding.
Thanks for the info Greg. I have checked the fluid level a week ago and its up at the top and the color is the regular chartreuse. I figured if it was the ECT that I would be getting temp readings well off normal and/or a code. Neither is there but will do a check with a meter when I purchase one. I wanted to borrow Tracy's but he didnt trust me with it.
Didnt get either of those codes you mentioned.
Will stop by Harbor Freight in the next few days to purchase a meter.