TOPIC: MPG Remedy

Appreciate the vote of confidence, Tracy. Thank you, kind sir.

I wholeheartedly concur with you on having a solid foundation of the basics in place. In doing what I do for a living, in my field, that often comes down to starting at the electrical system that everything runs on (especially in this digital day and age); in considering that we're messing with signals from sensors connected to a computer, I believe the same holds true here. It's imperative that the computer is getting accurate data from the sensors, not just from the correct sensors (oy, the manufacturer can't even tell you the right ones for the vehicle you bought from them? not good...), but by ensuring those sensors are presenting correct data from them to the computer...basic wiring...grounding!!!

Heysoundude, I'm assuming you are a sound tech, feel free to correct me if I'm in error. My best buddy- my roomate whom I've known 45 yrs- is also a sound guy, if you are I bet you guys could talk shop for hours.
To state the obvious- any system that operates on a basis of precision measurements or inputs- like a PA, or our cars, or say radar, today's aircraft, modern weapons systems, etc.etc....
As the saying goes, garbage in, garbage out.
I appreciate the light you've thrown on the idea of pre-Groove prep. I agree in most respects, though I would do a Mapster afterwards, as It is to attenuate the MAP sensor signal resulting from the Groove. Though you didn't mention it, the same would hold true for an EFIE on the O2(s).

We can of course decide how to proceed on our own vehicles. For customers, I inform them upfront about vacuum leaks and O2's, and general condition q/a. like how many miles, maintenance habits, etc.

It's been said before, and bears repeating: the Gadgetman Groove is a Process, not just a one-time thing.

again thanks for your sharp insights, I look forward to more!

Tracy G

I prefer sound balance engineer, but yeah, I push faders for a living. Mostly for tv and film of late, but I do get to drive big PAs still when the mood strikes.
You're absolutely correct about the signal to noise ratio and it's effect on the end result. I'm having a bunch of fun stretching my brain in the new ways I've experienced since I started hanging here. So thank you as well for your voice of experience.

A quick note that can help all trying this DIY additive.

A friend who's been using MPGR for a few months found that if aspirin (uncoated of course) is put in the container, and the hydrogen peroxide is added first-the aspirin will dissolve by itself. I verified this. I put one intact un-coated aspirin in the jar, and put a small amount of hyd. peroxide in, and watched the aspirin fall apart.

Personally I'll keep crushing the aspirin first, then mix w/ hydrogen peroxide, then add alcohol after aspirin dissolves. I will continue to filter the mix when adding to the gas tank.

Tracy G

Tracy, I just emailed you directly, but I'm hoping Dan Merrick sees this on here and chimes in.

in googling around for alternative fuels, I came across this archived thread:

The 2nd and 3rd posts made my eyebrows shoot up to my hairline..."upper cylinder lubricant" what what now? Isn't that what the Lucas treatment is??

I know e85 is getting more prevalent out there, and just a few weeks ago a local station started pumping e30, so I'm wondering if there is a way for me to use THAT in my non-flex Fuel engine for further savings. Glycerin, aspirin, peroxide, e30/e85...good consistent brew?

DanM, Help! straighten my brain, please...

UUmm, I wouldn't recommend the glycerin, Though I'll wait to see what Dan has to say w/ his chemistry knowledge.

Think I'd also not use the e-30 except perhaps as an additive in small amounts. 'Course, you could try some in a mix w/ normal gas, I'd be conservative, maybe no more than 1 gal e-30 mix w/ 4 gal normal gas, and see. I don't hold myself as expert on fuels-but I think ethanol in large doses can indirectly cause corrosion, as it's hydroscopic. Flex-fuel vehicles' fuel systems are designed w/ this in mind. I'm gonna go get some more HEET yellow bottle gas dryer to help pull water thru the system. I've used it mixed w/ MPGR for that purpose. In my Subie's case, I imagined a little bit of water in the fuel might work w/ the Plasma spark Ignition it has, using water as fuel is one idea behind the Plasma deal, there are numerous youtube vid's of the Plasma causing water to explode, or rapidly vaporise, or...?

Lucas fuel treat. is indeed an upper cyl. lubricant, I use Lucas for fuel in my gas, and Lucas for oil in my oil. They have a wide range of products. And I treated the Subie's engine w/ RVS. I like the idea of extra protection for this engine, as it seized 2 pistons almost 10 yrs ago, resulting in a rebuild. Perhaps we ought to start a new thread about this Greg, this MPGR thread is long in the tooth...? I'll check my email, thanks Greg!

Tracy G

Hey Guys,
Here is something to chew on. This is a quote from a post about Acetone and other additives in or for gasoline.
Conversely, alcohol based octane boosters, such as ethanol and methanol, actually increase the chemical surface tension of common gasoline, and this is precisely why less economy, less miles per gallon, occurs when using alcohol as an additive in gasoline. The presence of alcohol also reduces the effectiveness of Acetone.

So it seems like Acetone was an effective additive for gas to help break the surface tension and people were catching on and improving gas mileage so the powers that be would have none of that type of freedom from their grasp so ethanol was added and negated the Acetone benefits.
How evil can these reprobates be?


So how can we break the surface tension of fuel or ionize the fuel molecules to break them into smaller droplets? Find a way to do it chemically or physically. A combination of the two if possible would seem even more adventageous.
Here is one idea.



I'm sure there are patents for this that will not be available to the public.
Cant have the masses benefiting with better MPGs at the loss and control of these billoinaire devils now can we?
But here is an idea of the same thought that is a DIY type rig.

DIY Fuel Ionizer for Real Cheap. Really Works. : 9 Steps - Instructables


There are patents with this idea in play but not available for the public to benefit from, how nice.
The only public one that comes close to this idea I know of if a Fitch fuel catalyst.

Karl

--- Someone with all the chemical stuff can answer that question for sure. But when granddaddy showed me how shine made truck run, he told me "if its good for drinking its good for my truck". Uncle run many miles on granddaddy's truck, just shine in tank.
---- This acetone, ethanol and methanol are not good for most late model cars and trucks. Now a E30 is coming to stations. What will this do to older cars and trucks ????
geraldc

update
---- on my 1997 chev truck 15.6 mpg 2 tanks in a row then 13.6 mpg on last. Still using 8 uncoated aspirin with 3 oz. EverClear alcohol 190 proof filter by 4 white kitchen paper towels. I think temp was problem but not sure. Truck runs great. Still have cruise control turning off when lights turn on.

Hi Gerald, been awhile. Good post Karl, I'd guess the ethanol in gas came from needing an Oxegnate to replace MTBE that has contaminated groundwater. Ethanol may also be as Octane booster, don't forget the big corn Lobby worked to get ethanol mandated as gas additive.
Personally, I'd avoid the E30 gas unless Flex-Fuel equipped, in absence of further info saying otherwise. If gas w/ no Ethanol is available, it might work to use pure Acetone in place of alcohol in MPGR mix? Pure acetone can be found at beauty supply stores, other sources may have extra ingredients. If memory serves, the alcohol in MPGR is to be a carrier fluid for aspirin, that's also compatible w/ gas. As a concept, not so much alky needed, just to "wash the aspirin down" the filler neck of tank.

And again- I've tried a test of one whole un-coated aspirin, put maybe a capful of hydrogen peroxide on it, it melted before my eyes. So I'll put aspirin/hydro. perox. together first, then add the alky last now. Still filter the mix into gas tank of course. I add Lucas fuel treat. at fillup separate from MPGR.

I made my own ELVIS using a Summit Racing sourced gas filter that screws together, intended for low-press system (carburetor). Can't say it made any difference, but for the zinc content I just cut galvanized nails up, some small copper pieces, no magnets, forget the other ingredients.

The Fitch has been around for years, I've no experience w/ it.

To me the beauty of MPG Remedy is-it works, it's simple to make/use and cheap except for Everclear. I've been told that 90% rubbing alcohol (Wally-mart) or denatured alcohol from big box hardware store will work too, in place of Everclear. Other grafted-in stuff is cool if it works for an application. I even have a hologram sticker on the outside of gas tank (can't say it worked either).

But the basics gotta be right to begin with- and I'm waiting for Karl to tell of his O2 Sensor replacement, I really hope it helps!! Another thing Karl and I spoke of recently was the issue of fixing/improving the electrical grounds on the engine. The whole dang ECU/Sensor system, engine, car body and frame, must have good solid grounds!! Even the exhaust system (the O2 sensors). Rust/corrosion never sleeps. It isnt so expensive to deal w/ this. A "sleeper" issue somewhat related, is battery voltage creeping from + to - terminals ON the battery thru the accumulating acid/grunge that can build up. Keep it clean, the terminals, cable ends, the battery top. I periodically clean these, using spray can acid neutralizer, a rag and toothbrush, use a batt. terminal tool to dress the battery posts/cable ends, then use a bit of vaseline on the terminals and posts. Basic maintenance. Good to look at a winter sets in.

first bake, THEN frost the cake

Tracy G

Tracy,

I dont want to use too much H202 since its mainly water(97%).

I've got my ELVIS on now for about 1000 miles and no difference.
I used more copper and two Neodymium magnets after running it for 800 miles with no noticeable difference. Added more copper and the magnets seeing that is the combo that had the greatest reaction as far as an electrostatic charge which is what I think I need.
Even tried Star Tron enzyme to neutralize ethanol effects.
Didn't notice any difference there yet either.

Installed 2 new 02 sensors after weeks of research to get the right ones.
Reset the ECU by unhooking the positive cable for an hour and now have been running it for about 150 miles and dont really see a difference. Imagine that. One sensor was a generic and the other was 14 years and 290k miles old. You would think something would change.
Well I did get rid of the p0133 sensor code but the p0171 lean code is still there with the IAC p1506 code.
Its amazing how all these mods work for most but to have all these mods with no difference in HP or MPG is amazing. Maybe if someone rode in my truck and had their own ranger of similar model, they may tell me how well it rides/feels but that is speculation. Sometimes there is so subtle a change each time that you dont notice a difference. Like a frog with the water slowly turned up till he boils. The one thing I heard positive was when the mechanic changed my head gasket after 270k miles.
He said he was shocked to hear this was the original engine. It was clean(pistons I guess)and the pressure each cylinder was between 160-173lbs. Can only guess my water injection cleaned the carbon off the pistons and the RVS gave me the great cylinder pressure. Just guessing on these.

Like I stated before, the ECU can stop every mod in its tracks if its commanded to do so. Read a post once where a guy did a mod with no difference so he went to a junk yard to see if he could get a chip from a similar vehicle. He puts it in and what a surprise, the difference was amazing. He gained 20mpg.Truck was a whole new creature with a $10 used chip from the junk yard. He installed an EFIE with a vaporizer but didnt see the change until replacing the chip. Looks like an EFIE is my next move but will install the vaporizer first since I removed it seeing it didnt change anything with the old 02s. Will see if anything changes now.
The OBD 1 was not as sophisticated as my OBD2 and there were many doing mods that the OBD1 missed. They were getting 20-100% better MPGs from all the posts I read so the puppet masters had to come up with a better mouse trap/ECU to stop that nonsense.
Who knows, maybe one day something will click but I dont expect it.
As far as the battery, have never seen any corrosion there. Just one main ground that I fixed from the engine to firewall but that fix didnt change anything.

I have the 90% alcohol from Wally but just do 50% more aspirin than required and mix it with the HEET and Lucas. Then add about 6 ounces of Toluene for the octane. The H202 I keep to a minimum since you are basically adding 97% water if you do. If Dan only adds a drop, dont think the H202 does much for chemically changing the gas since the minute amount of H202 in that drop of water seems moot. I tried about a 1/16 cup once in desperation to see if it would really change anything just in case some chemistry miracle was in it that I didnt understand.
Have seen some patents that used Tolouene, acetone, naptha and kerosene as part of their formula.
Wondering if this was before the whole ethanol junk they forced on us.
Karl

Hey Karl, just a couple of things to note -

The Elvis link returns a 404-Not Found message. do you have any of the materials in HTML or JPG or PDF form that you can share with us here?

Dan uses 30% peroxide, commonly found at health food stores, as do I. I've also sourced (and use) 99% isopropyl alcohol at my local Costco. The improvement is small but noticable, and I've been tracking with both a Gas Manager app on my iphone that calculates mileage based on odometer-delta vs. amount pumped and my EngineLink OBDii app that gives instantaneous and long term average MPG with regards to speed/distance travelled, airflow metering (so AFR factors in), injector activity...the correlation is closing in as data accumulates, and it's still ballpark-ish data, but the general trend in terms of mileage/efficiency on my truck is upwards with each mod implementation/repair. When I started my quest/journey to "peak efficiency" around the time I stumbled on this website, I was getting a combined ~15 MPG. A tune-up (including increased plug gap and cleaned MAF), adjusting my idle speed, applying the remedy, and RVS (as well as learning how to keep my right foot light and easy on the throttle) now have me in the ~22 MPG range, PRE-Groove, and I'm still chasing parasitic system losses in terms of energy transfer to the road (I need new front wheel bearings and brakes/tires all around and an alignment), and have yet to apply RVS to differential and transmission, or get my pre- and post-cat o2 sensors changed out. I'm toying with the DPFE hack to effectively bypass (I think) the EGR system so the ECU sees richer averages at pre-cat o2s and adjusts fuel trims further, and I bet I can increase my plug gap another 20% or more. Oh Yeah, then there's the grounding I want to address as well, and swapping to an e-fan and 180 degree thermostat and maybe getting pulleys on, and this is without chasing vacuum leaks...or messing with fuel constitution any further. Keep chasing it Karl! Something will no doubt pop to bring it all together after all this time.

From 15 to 22 is almost 50% and is a huge difference.
Heard about those Iphone apps and one I heard about that gives all the specs like fuel trims and such. Is that what you have and does it give fuel trims?
Was going to get one since my ScangaugeII doesnt give fuel trims unless you go through a complex process to install another program. Tried installing with no success.

Tried blocking off the EGR a while back with an aluminum plate but didnt see a difference so I took the plate off. Maybe the ECU would take time to adjust and I took it off too soon, I dont know.
Thought that was where some of the vacuum was being lost so gave it a try without the results I wanted to see.


The link works for me but the best way to get it for you would be to go to google and type in "diy fuel ionizer" and its the first link that comes up for me. Very simple mod but it takes time to find the right filter to use for it and cut the pieces to insert. Just make sure you have all the tools you need to insert into the fuel line or you could be stuck. My fuel line is a one piece from the filter below the frame to the rail. The only place to insert was by cutting the flex hose and inserting it there unless you wanted to buy a new fuel filter under the truck and fill that one and replace. Didnt like that since it would take much more to fill and taking it off to maybe add different materials in the future would have been a hassle. My flex hose was a 3/8th hose and I had a 1/4" filter which only created a problem. Luckily I was able to quickly purchase the 3/8 filter to replace. Use good hose clamps that are the right size and torque them on well since the pressure in the line is higher than most vehicles.
Below is two filters I tried. The one on the left was a failure. That was the one someone else tried with success so I tried that one even though I didnt like the fact that it was plastic. The truck ran rough as I looked at the filter for leaks. Didnt like the fact that it was plastic so I kept an eye on it after starting. Noticed the top starting to bulge and realized the filter was blocking fuel flow too much. Took it off and replaced with the one on the right which is working fine and I have the one you see in the pic as a backup just in case the one I have on now gives a problem.
Karl